Cooper tune.. yea.. I hate TYREKICKERS..  seen my sign at my lot.? I SHOOT Tyrekickers.. I know all about the STUPICS asking for car fax on 25 year plus minis all the time..  and the worse tyrekickers..   MUST have LHD and AC.. then the death words.  do you finance?? or let me ask the WIFE.. grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

From what I saw on the Hemming's site you referenced, I only saw 2 cars that stood out as re-vins. So, the statement that nearly half of them are re-vins is not accurate. Anyway, not picking at you, just hoping to clarify it. But, back to the original question...I personally wouldn't have a problem buying or owning one of them. Are there risks? Certainly! As we live in a sue happy world with plenty of folks looking to get big payoffs and lawyers with no ethics, if you're doing anything questionable you're at risk. As a very good lawyer explained to me once, "the more you have, the more you have to lose!". Anyway, from my personal perspective, there is little risk IMHO! You are wise to do your homework and if you're really concerned about a particular car, I'd seek helpful advice from someone who has been around Minis for a long time. Also, as stated before, pay no attention to the troll known as "specialist" as he knows nothing and opens his mouth without any brain attached. One major thing I'd avoid is buying any classic Mini with an automatic transmission. They are very delicate in the fact that they function on engine oil instead of transmission fluid. They require 2000 mile oil changes if you expect them to last. Very few folks maintain them that regularly, especially if it lived in England for a long time. Oil changes there are expensive and are sometimes pushed. Good luck and feel free to seek help. Cheers!

Good and Awesome I am happy to join this community very informative thank you for sharing get knowledge 2wire

You understand a whole lot its almost hard to argue with you (not that I personally will need to…HaHa).
You definitely put a brand new spin on a subject that has been discussed for many years. Excellent stuff, just excellent!
Share a link ,I find it useful:192.168.0.1

Coopertune:

Congrats on the sale

Maybe now you will come to MMEast and see my 1960 red Austin Se7en Estate woody wagon with the 997cc Cooper engine and running gear with twin SU carbs & of course the 7" disc brakes

Internal tank,smooth roof, Nov 1960 build with great wood-

Probably the best estate that l have ever owned, including my former Tim Bosse engineered white one, 1380cc-

Big AL After a lot of sourcing for small bits and trim it is ready to to go to a new home in the USA

60 sold! knew it was to good to last. Steve (CTR)

Dave - for a fun runaround car you say you are looking for, there should be plenty around to choose form that are not a revin. Why take the risk?

BC, I have already received a couple request for the pics. As a rule the cars I get a chance to sell are very nice and move rather slowly. Owners are long time mini owners with cars they have owned for years. Health or other life issues are reason for sale not because they want to. We take our time and find a correct match. I have had an interested buyer I have worked with for over a year. I kicked him to the curb yesterday when he ask for a Car Fax on a 57 year old mini. The funny part was I had my IT guy send him pics and specs on the car. He turned right around and tried to buy the car direct from my IT guy. I have provided him excellent info on a good selection of cars and explained the buyer pays me and if he is very happy he can tip me if he likes. I much prefer buying to selling but can't afford them all. I understand your feeling about tire kickers. Yes, also to the ( my wife ) crap. I have had one for 34 years and as long as she has wheels and it's not a mini she could care less what I do with minis. Steve (CTR)

Dave, shoot me an email ( contact info in profile ) I will send you the pictures of the 60. It is LHD and been in this country since then, one owner in PA for the last 12 years. A MK 1 classic with all the upgrades, suspension, brakes, engine, tranny,wheels, tires, gauge and interior upgrades. It never hurts to look. Steve (CTR)

I feel this car is under priced and a true value. I'l be glad to send pics to anyone interested. 

Just wanted to quickly thank everyone for their opinions, which I appreciate.  CooperTune - timing not quite right for a chat yet but I will definitely reach out when it is.

Regards,

Dave

I ended up with five Minis while I lived in South Dakota, two from other states and three from other countries and the DMV titled them without any inspection. I had to re-title them now that I live in Utah and the local police had to come verify that the indentity plates matched the S.D. title. They only cared about that one set of numbers. So, states are all over the board on legality, so you might want to contact your state's DMV to acquaint yourself with what rules you will have to comply with when getting them titled/registered. Randy

I owned a revin... paperwork started right= transfered without question = DMV only new a  vin number and year for all the paperwork.

Quite simply that mini was GREAT - Drove the wheels off it.

These later cars are honestly the Best insulated Mini to have. IN MY OPINION....
     Fuel injection IS reliable + transmission gearing beats any classic gearing any day for Interstate travel.
 when time (having a baby, I) Sold the car on - to a notified owner what he was getting and he loves it too = still enjoys it just as much as i DID.  Paperwork...

If you're worried about ' reposesssion or faulty paperwork = be sure to buy a known old 25 yrs older car. If you can already identify revins.. you're ahead of the game.  Many people get a 71 mini thinking its a 71 - but find out its much later like  a 91-or a 94....

Buy wisely that you know will protect your 'Investment"

Plug = //www.minimania.com/cars4sale/14359/1980_Austin_Countryman_Van_998cc is a good car. Local that I have previously worked on.

Ah, of course a hot topic!  Here's an article I wrote:


https://classicmini.wordpress.com/2016/01/13/what-car-did-i-just-buy-the-re-vin-game-and-classic-minis/

It seems there are a lot of revins around. Some like SPI and MPI cars seem to make people nervous. At a local car show a few years back there was a MPI in the line with a sign on the screen (1967 Mk 1 Cooper S) when I spoke to the owner he assured me it had a full resto with modern parts. When I ask him to open the boot so I could find out what year it was, he collected his stuff and left the show. 

I currently have a couple of minis for sale if you want a truly legal car I have a very nice 60 out fitted with Cooper and S parts. 1275 power, 7.5 disc fully adjustable suspension 5 x 10 Cosmics, remote 1128 tranny. Needs nothing drive it home. Also have a mid 80s Mayfair just completed a full mechanical, engine, tranny, fully adjustable completely new suspension, brakes 8.4 new disc, SS pistons, pads, shoes hoses, rear cyls, shoes and master. Also a car you could fly in drive home.

I have been wondering about the revins that have come of age since arriving here. Will there ever be a chance to make them truly legal at some point. Contact me if interested in either of the cars I have for sale. Steve (CTR)

Edit: is a 60 not 59

Regarding personal legally, the statute of limitations on an individual who had done it is 5 years, so if it was imported longer ago than that, that's one thing and if you didn't import it yourself that would be a further remove.

Regarding the car itself, as John pointed out, states differ on their level of attentiveness to this, on cars already existing.

Interesting side note, those vehicles are reaching the legal 25 years of age as we speak.

However, a car which has a secretly switched number is in violation of the law in every state, and federally, regardless of how much time has passed.  The likelihood of that being an issue for an individual owner of an individual car depends on a number of variables.  There were some highly public seizures of vehicles (Land Rovers) from private hands, though, that ended up being an illegal act in itself and most of those vehicles were eventually returned to their owners (after a big legal battle).

In the end, there are, as you noted, a lot of these things running around, and most of the time and in most of the states, it doesn't seem to be all that big of a deal.  But, there is still the fact that when you get right down to it the risk of if there is an insurance claim that brings it up, or whatever, which could possibly lead to more than simply a refused claim.

When looking at minis like that in the past what I really wanted to know, after weighing all of those points, what stood out the most to me, was that I would have wanted to be able to verify that it was not a stolen vehicle.  Unfortunately, the UK MOT doesn't have a way for a prospective buyer to be able to confirm that.  Sadly, I haven't been able to figure out how,anyway, and so have passed on suspect cars for sale in the US. 


It would sure be nice if there was a way to arrange for "mini amnesty" of an over 25 year old one already in the US, to reinstate its original VIN number and make it a safe mini again, instead of a mini Anne Frank.


N

Hi Dave,

First things first. If forum member "specialist" pops up in your thread please ignore any comments of his. Sometimes little cars attract small people. 

1. Issues with title transfer and registration (I live in NJ - not sure how strict they are here - I know about the recent crush incident but that was an attempted import?)

Thankfully you are not in California. Generally if the Mini is already in the DMV system of your state you are pretty safe. At the end of the day it is still a gamble owning a re-vin.  

2. Outright seizure - how might that happen?

So a Mini can be re-vinned to get a newer car into the country. And they can also get re-vinned to hide the fact it was stolen. Many of the newer Mini's have hidden VIN numbers stamped into the bodywork. While the local DMV may not know where to find (or care to look) these VIN's there are plenty of agencies that will. When looking the first question should be ... is it a re-vin? Second question is ... why is it a re-vin? 

3. Insurance - would insuring such a vehicle imply insurance fraud in some way?  "Ignorance" not a protection I assume?  Is there any other way to get them insured while remaining honest?

Are you really going to count on the interwebs for an answer to this question? 

4. What do the community think of folks who buy these?  It would be a bummer to become an immediate outcast from the start.

In my book any classic Mini is a real Mini. Sometimes I even covet the modern features of the later production cars. Except for the 12in & 13in wheels. Mini's belong on 10in tires for sure.

That's all I got,

John

Hi Everyone,
                 First of all - apologies if this has been covered extensively in the past, but I have found it hard to find a good way to search the threads in this forum..

So - I am considering making the plunge and purchasing my first "classic".  After a bit of research, its become pretty obvious that a large percentage of classic's available for sale in the U.S. have had some kind of "identity management" from the very subtle which might be argued successfully in court as refurbishment, to the blindingly obvious illegal imports such as a mid 90's Mpi being sold as a 1960's Mk II.  Case in point - even to my very inexperienced eyes - almost half of the listings here have clearly been revin'ed: https://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/?0=0&adtypeFacet=Vehicles%20for%20Sale&q=mini%2Bcooper&year_rangeFacet[]=1990%27s&year_rangeFacet[]=1980%27s&year_rangeFacet[]=1970%27s&year_rangeFacet[]=1960%27s&sort=relevance&page_size=15&country[]=US

Thing is - I'm not in the market for a "concours aspirations" vehicle, at least not at this stage.  I'm in the market for something fun, good value and to mechanically tinker with - a true heritage vehicle would be inappropriate (I would spoil it) and probably out of my budget.  To me, for these reasons something like an early 90's spi/mpi posing as something older for Uncle Sam actually seems attractive to a certain extent.  The (slight) safety enhancements made in later marks are also appealing.

This said - what are the "real world" implications for purchasing a classic which has had its identity modified?  I am aware that in theory many states have the power to seize such vehicle's from the present owner - but how often does that actually happen?  And in what circumstances?

In my mind the risks are;

1. Issues with title transfer and registration (I live in NJ - not sure how strict they are here - I know about the recent crush incident but that was an attempted import?)
2. Outright seizure - how might that happen?
3. Insurance - would insuring such a vehicle imply insurance fraud in some way?  "Ignorance" not a protection I assume?  Is there any other way to get them insured while remaining honest?
4. What do the community think of folks who buy these?  It would be a bummer to become an immediate outcast from the start.


On the face of it - these risks seem pretty significant - yet I cannot avoid the fact that it would seem that a significant percentage of the classics in the U.S. seem to be in this very place, along with their owners.


So can those with more experience help me make a risk / reward trade off here?  Should I stick with full chassis/vin matching or is the "grey world" something I can dip my toes into if the risks are manageable?


I appreciate all of your advice.


Thanks!


Dave.